Intro
I'm joined by Finn Brodie, the one-man-band behind The Mythical Press, a monthly magazine for Draw Steel. How does he intend to keep up pace, what can we look forward to and tell us more about the Rotterhund and the 2-in-1 siren.
I'm Jon de Nor and this is Goblin Points.
Interview
Jon de Nor: Welcome to Goblin Points, Finn Brodie!
Finn Brodie: Hi! Thanks for having me.
Jon de Nor: Let's hear a introduction about yourself, and also how you came into the Matt Colville/MCDM community.
Finn Brodie: This is the Mythical Press. I am the Mythical Press, I guess. I am the writer, the illustrator, and designer for everything. So everything you see in my magazines is purely me. I also have, I do wanna give a shoutout to my friends at Lychen. They've created a small band, at Lychen, and I want to do more folk music. And so they've been doing some music for me, which I'm hoping to release at a later date. So I also want to shut them out as well.
But, yeah, the Mythical Press is, we're in month two now, and the support from the MCDM community has been incredible. So just a segue into where I fit in all that as well is, I've been watching Matt Colville since, I think, his first year. I was very early on. I started playing D&D pretty much when 5e first came out and there was this perfect sort of world where I was first or second year of university, and I probably should have been doing more studying, but I discovered D&D. Critical Role had just came out and I'd started watching that.
I discovered Matt Colville from, I think...oh, I'm so I'm not sure. I just happened upon him and then just started watching videos and then, yeah, I was hooked. And going through like the early days of Campaign 1 for Critical Role, and I would go and watch Matt Colville's videos, and I'd spend hours writing stories and yeah, it was...and then Stranger Things came out as well. And yeah. So, I was really, when D&D was exploding, I was there. But I guess I don't...I haven't been...I haven't made it such a big part of my life until very recently when I was like...I got back into drawing during lockdown, and I was...
I didn't know that I wanted to be an illustrator. I enjoyed writing, but I'd always been a drawer, and that was my passion, is drawing and artwork and that kind of stuff. But the...I put it away for like so many years. And then during lockdown, I came back into it because I was playing more and I was playing twice a week, which is unheard of nowadays. And just seeing, and just, you know...I'd be running games and having these amazing moments from my friends and then just these images burned in my head, and I was like, "I need to get it down." And as soon as I started drawing all these images and these creatures and that kind of stuff, it's just reignited the spark within me and I realized I should have been doing it the whole time.
Yeah. So, and then that kind of evolved from there, and the past six years was just wanting to, yeah, create more stuff. And I'd created monsters all the time for my friends. I'm very used to breaking things and designing monsters, and I had my own thought processes about how monsters should be designed and how they should look, and being disappointed in 5e creatures, and then thinking I can make this better. I think I can make this more interesting.
And then, yeah, just evolved and evolved and evolved. And so I saw making D&D creatures. So the Mythical Press is actually not new for Draw Steel. I was actually doing the exact same thing for D&D for a good six to...maybe eight months, I think. But I just got nowhere. There was no, I was you know, I was posting like fairly regularly every month, a new creature was coming out. and it looked quite similar to what my magazines are now, but there was just no appetite for it, I guess. I would get a few, like, a few people coming through and looking at that kind of stuff and maybe some would become a member. But really there was nothing.
And then Draw Steel came out a few months after I'd released Mythical Press for D&D. And it was Flee, Mortals that pushed me to make Mythical Press, because I thought, you know, Flee, Mortals did amazingly, there's clearly an appetite here, a desire for people who want more tactical monsters, and something with a little more grit and something for them to like chew on as DMs.
But when it came down to and there was no interest, I kind of thought, well, if all the people — and then Draw Steel obviously was doing amazingly — there a tiny little part of me that thought, "Well, if everybody who liked Flee, Mortals...I think probably have just come over to Draw Steel, I imagine. Then that's clearly where my audience are. Those people who want to see that's what they are." And I was already inside Draw Steel. Like I backed it, what, three years ago, now? I'd backed it before I even made the first Mythical Press and then yeah, it came out.
And then I kind of stayed away from it. I didn't want to really delve into it until I got my, the book, since I know, like, the early playtest stuff was coming out, and people were reading that and talked about it, but I largely stayed away from it until I got the physical books. We were playing a campaign for the Fallout TTRPG with my friends, and that came to a natural close. And then we were all chomping at the bit to play Draw Steel, and I was really excited to play Draw Steel.
And then as soon as that happened, we were all hooked on that, and that's when I started...that's when I closed the Mythical Press's chapter with D&D and just thought, it's much easier, in a way, to make stuff, make creatures and interesting mechanics around creatures, for Draw Steel than it is for D&D. Which is one thing that really surprised me actually, because I used to find my ideas for the creatures would overreach D&D's mechanics, I guess. Like, if I wanted to...let's say I did a dragon or something, some sort of creature like that. I thought, you know, a cool chase scene down a mountain. You know, you've just stolen one of its treasure and you escape down the mountain while it's chasing you. That could be a really cool thing.
I would have to invent montage tests and rules for that to happen. I can't just give you, I can't just use the template that Draw Steel has for their montage tests and be like, and do it for mine. I had to create the rules myself. And that was draining and took ages. And it wasn't very fun. But then, as soon as I came to Draw Steel, I'm like, well, the montage tests are just there. And all the books come with, like the encounter books for the different stories come with tactics pages on how to basically do a fight with each creature. And I was like, right, I can use that as a template and riff off of that and make it my own and make it more interesting and do it for my creatures.
It was just like they were...square peg in a round hole with D&D. And then when it came to Draw Steel, it just fit perfectly, Which is, it makes sense because it was Matt Colville and Flee, Mortals, that kind of stuff, that pushed me to make this kind of stuff, and then the game that they made for themselves is the one that just fits naturally.
So yeah. And then once I released it, Mythical Press for Draw Steel, I wanted to really get into tune, and meet the community, I guess, which is not something I've really done before. I never got into the D&D community. I was just playing with my friends and that was it. But since this became much more serious for me than just the game I played once a week...yeah, it's been, I've started recognizing names now, and people are commenting, and I know them, and they commented before, and this person is a member and sees me in the comments and that kind of stuff, or liking this, and it feels much more of a community rather than just an empty theater with about five people that I was trying to shelter. It feels more like a more enclosed room, but a full room rather than just trying to shout into an empty theater. So it's been a wonderful experience, the past two months. And I'm hoping for more.
Jon de Nor: And speaking of past two months, because you've been you've set a pace of one magazine a month, which is, I would say, very ambitious. Are you confident you're going to be able to keep up with that pace?
Finn Brodie: So it's...it is once a month. But with three breaks a year.
Jon de Nor: Okay, but still though! (laughter)
Finn Brodie: Yeah, it is...I have set a pace. But I've also made, I'm also working four months ahead. So I'm currently working on November's release, and then we'll be having December break, which means that when I start work on the creature after that, which should be done in September, I'm working on January's. So I'm very much working ahead of myself, which is what's, when I stopped doing D&D creatures, I basically spent four months making content, so that when I when I was ready to release, I'm working ahead of myself. I'm not chasing my tail constantly. And the break every three months really does stagger it quite nicely for me.
I find each one typically takes around 3 to 4 weeks to make. So it's basically one a month. And then with a month break. So as long as I don't fall behind, it should be...I feel confident that I'm working at a nice pace. The month breaks are purely because, you know, unforeseen things can happen. Like, we're having a break for, September because I'm moving, which is a stressful time. I don't want to add to stress and feel like I need to rush out something. I also don't want to, you know, if I try and rush something, then the content's not gonna...I feel like it will tell.
So yeah. And I feel like the base design for each magazine is, I think, can be thrown together quite quickly. I usually, I spend a bit of time sort of getting some ideas together, and references, and I'll watch some things and that'll give me some more ideas. And now I can basically just vomit out all the words and every idea, and I'll just have these massive brainstorms, and I find from there, it all just flows very quickly
But I will, I also intersperse it with...some creatures, I feel, deserve more content, and other creatures are just something you just want to just hack and slash at and they're just great for one big fight, and that's their purpose. And then some creatures, like the witch that will be coming out in October, has a lot more content surround it than the rotterhund or the siren. There's no montage test; there wasn't one in my head that came to me that I felt would be a good fit. So I just didn't include it. But there are negotiations. There's a whole page for negotiations with a witch.
Jon de Nor: Makes sense. (laughter)
Finn Brodie: Exactly, yeah. I don't want to force a montage test where I don't feel like there is one. But a negotiation can replace that and work perfectly. So, you know, it's the information on, like, what she might want and what she might be able to give. Which I think — with negotiations, I've also listened to the feedback from the community about how some things in Draw Steel are lacking. Which is absolutely fine. Like, we all love this game, but it's not a perfect game.
Jon de Nor: Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Finn Brodie: But there's this room to grow there. So I'm excited, I'm really excited for the witch. I don't want to speak too much about it, but I've been working with some friends that I think are gonna, kind of...should maybe change negotiations a little bit, and get people thinking about how they could apply similar things to every creature, potentially with a negotiation. It made sense to me when I was making a witch that a negotiation with a creature like that should feel meaningfully different.
In the same way you imagine, like, negotiation with a dragon, you know, in the books, there's a bit for negotiating with the dragon, that says you can swap this out with a king or something like that. And that doesn't feel right to me. It doesn't feel like you could be able to swap out a negotiation with a dragon with a king. A negotiation with a dragon should feel like you're negotiating with a dragon.
So I imagine, like in The Hobbit, where, you know, Smaug's eyes come over Bilbo and he starts sweating profusely and he gets the shakes. I feel like that should be a thing in negotiating with a dragon. You know, you lose Recoveries for like, how long you for...for each negotiation you make, its always like, fall on you. That kind of makes it feel like you're negotiating with a dragon. So I've had that mindset going into it. So hopefully that comes across, and hopefully I make more in the future.
Jon de Nor: I'm very intrigued now by the witch.
Finn Brodie: Yeah. I'm really excited for it to come out. I think there's a there's a lot that I'm working with there, and it probably...I'm confident people will find a lot to love there. But I'm also happy that it's almost like a...not a first draft in a way, but it's definitely stuff that maybe we haven't seen that much from Draw Steel yet. So I'm excited to get some feedback from that from the community. And then do more of that in the future after having listened to them. So yeah, I'm very excited.
Jon de Nor: I'm a sucker for negotiations. I love the idea and...but the implementation in the core rules doesn't live up to my ideas necessarily. (laughter) But I feel like they are incorrectly maligned by parts of the community. I think they have a lot of potential. I just think they need a bit longer in the oven. So now I'm really looking forward to the witch, because I've also looked at a supplement recently called Speak Carefully, which kind of tries to do a mix of stuff with negotiations. And there's also, The Withering War, which also leans heavily on negotiations, according to the author. I feel like I'm...(laughter)...I'm getting all these treats now.
Finn Brodie: I want more.
Jon de Nor: Yeah! (laughter)
Finn Brodie: The first negotiations my players, and I ever had. It was kind of like...it was odd. It felt like we were doing something wrong, but then it all, like, suddenly clicked with all of us at the same time. And the rest was just a blast. And we had such fun with our first negotiation.
But then naturally, we did more negotiations and I start to see what the cracks are. And I thought, okay, there's there's a sense of like...my players aren't dumb. They've been playing TTRPGs with me for about ten years now. And we've played quite a few as well. So they know how to...they know how a game is played. and they know that they can maybe win it in a certain way. And that's kind of what I don't like with negotiations. There's a sense of, "I can win this." Like, the devil character knows they can ask a question every single time, and they'll probably get a likely answer because they're very good at it. As in, ask them what they want, and potentially get one of their motivations, or learn what one of their pitfalls are. And there's a sense of game in that.
So yeah, that's that's where I get into the sense of like, some creatures should be able to, you know...like the players have ways of interacting with negotiations, but monsters don't. And I feel like that's unfair. (laughter) So I'm intrigued for monsters to have their own abilities and their own traits that work within negotiations. I can imagine there are some creatures that are quite impatient. And might grow more angry the more you ask them what they want. So it just forces the players to think a little bit more rather than just be like, slamming the "What do you want?" button.
So yeah. I've got ideas and I'm excited to implement them a little bit more. The witch is like the first draft of that, I think. So I'm excited to see what people think. And maybe I can do better in the future, or if people start using that for themselves and thinking for themselves about how other creatures would have, similar traits. But yeah, I'm excited.
Jon de Nor: And speaking of creatures, let's jump back to the first issue, the rotterhund.
Finn Brodie: Yeah, I mean, there's...the rotterhund came to me in a fever dream. (laughter) And the name I just plucked out of...I literally think I dreamed it up at one point, but it's stuck in my head. But, like, big black hounds are rife in old folklore. And that's the kind of stories that I'm really interested in. And I'm excited to bring that to Draw Steel. That kind of, like, Scandinavian or Old English or Celtic folklore. The rotterhund is based off of like, a Welsh creature and also the barghest. So it's one of those...it fits into that same category of "large black hound", but an original take on it as well.
Jon de Nor: My immediate thought went to the Hounds of Baskerville for some reason.
Finn Brodie: Yeah, there's that as well. That's on me. It's like, large black hounds are a thing for typically European English folklore, it's definitely a thing. So I was really excited, and that's my own creation. So I was excited to for that to be my debut feature, I guess.
Jon de Nor: It feels very mythological immediately with the...I wrote down "baby-snatching theme". It sounds a bit horrible, but you also have a content warning on the first page, second page about, about there being, like, infanticide, and there might be a sensitive topic to some. Which I appreciate, but it also makes it feel very...to me, it immediately feels very, like, Brothers Grimm kind of a fairy tale, where...which often are very grotesque, and the modern versions, retellings, are much more sanitized.
Finn Brodie: Definitely. Very watered down, very kid-friendly, instead of being strictly kid-unfriendly. (laughter) But yeah, it was one of those things where I saw that Draw Steel also had content warnings for their stuff. And my initial response was not to include a content warning. It wasn't like — not that my initial thought was to omit it. It's just I didn't think about it. But when I thought, when I had a deeper thought about it...you know, you don't know what people's backstories are. I don't want my creatures to come across...like, my creatures are rooted in quite dark fantasy. But that doesn't mean that that has to be a dark fantasy creature. I feel like it can just be a large black hound that is aggressive, and that'll be absolutely fine.
But also, if people ever wanted a darker take for their tales, which is a very classic fairy tale thing, it can also fit that door perfectly. I don't want to, I would hate to read through that and think, "Oh, this is a really cool monster," and then read about it snatching children and then be like, "Eh, it's not my bag, I'll stop reading."
Jon de Nor: Yeah, yeah.
Finn Brodie: That's sad. I would hate for someone to be reading my magazines and see that. So, something I'll be thinking about going forward is just, does this creature have a very strong sense, or part of its story, do something where I feel like it really does need a content warning? And it's, I more and more lean more towards dark fantasy stuff. It's the old Celtic, the European folktales are pretty gnarly. They're not...they're pretty gruesome. And I really enjoy that, and a lot of people do, but it's not for everyone. And I know that. Don't want to put people off unnecessarily.
Jon de Nor: I think also the cover image of the rotterhund is fantastic. And it just, it immediately evoked like the right kind of vibe with how dark it is and the...just the, like the parts of the hound being like, the innards being exposed, and the chaos of the legs. (laughter)
Finn Brodie: Yeah, the legs were to anyone who's an artist out there, the composition for all six legs was difficult. It was difficult to not make it look like they're just everywhere. But no, I'm really happy with it. It was, I really...the style I want to go for the Mythical Press covers is that classic heavy metal magazine.
Jon de Nor: Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Finn Brodie: Like the old Frazettas and that kind of that, Boris Vallejo. But with probably less naked women. So, a more modern-friendly version. Yeah, so that's what inspired the images. And also that was one of the things I changed from D&D, of, I kind of put it...down with a little bit of a "illustrator tries to make his way in the world" tangent: I was trying to treat every cover, when I was doing Mythical Press for D&D, like a portfolio piece. And I was putting a lot of work into it, and I'm quite proud of them. I learned a lot. I can do that. I know I can do better now, but only because I've made mistakes with them. And I spent a lot of time with them. And I now know I can do my artwork to a higher length to those higher standards.
But the covers took like three weeks, right? It's just not tenable. I could have done it sooner, but I also work part time through all this time. I also change up just the style of my covers, where I want to throw everything at the wall and make them really like awesome, and eye-catching, and very heavy metal. But they also need to be simple. And I need to not get carried away. I want to throw literally everything at the wall. It just needs to stand...yeah, it's very much like I need to not treat every piece like it's gonna go sit in my portfolio. Every single piece should just be a fun and awesome cover that takes me a week to make, without having to...
So yeah, that's another sort of thing that's giving me the confidence to be, I think I can manage a monthly magazine because I made all the mistakes with the first iteration of Mythical Press. And stressing myself out unnecessarily, and each magazine would take two weeks to write and then two and a half weeks, up to three weeks, to make the cover for. And as soon as it gets past that one-month mark, I know I'm now dealing with time I don't have. So I really trimmed everything down to get to a stage where I can feel like this is doable within 3 to 4 weeks.
Jon de Nor: I also wanted to talk about one part of the design of the rotterhund, because...you call it a dirge hound. like it's commonly known as a dirge hound. And it has this dirge mechanic where it starts getting louder and louder the further into combat you go. Where...? To me, it almost read like...like, Malice is like the Heroic Resource of the Director, but the dirge points that you've added to the rotterhund almost feels like a Heroic Resource for the rotterhund specifically, where there are certain triggers that makes it build up more and more of these dirge points, which then translates into more powerful attacks. Or at least...yeah.
Finn Brodie: Yeah. I think it gains 1 at the start of each turn, and then it has different Malice features that also give it more dirge points, or give its dirge, like, the next time people hear it, it weakens them or something like that. But I'm not really sure where the idea of the dirge came from. Draw Steel just has...designing for it is so open-ended. I feel like I can just add in something like dirge points and it feels normal and natural and intuitive.
But yeah, it was, it was really a sense of...I wanted players to, again, think more. It's not just a case of, you know, you know, the big tanks go in and start harrying it. It's like, well, it also hits very hard. And if I start my turn right next to it, I'll be taking a chunk more damage. So it plays really interesting. It's almost like this thing of, get in close, but then also, I don't want to be next to it, so I need to leave and get away from it. And so it plays really interestingly. And I would love to hear if anyone has stories, if they've used it in their game, stories about it because, it's a really fun monster.
I guess that also leads me on to the Director's Cut for the higher tier, where I get to like, expand on the monsters a little bit more. So I think the dirge for the base version of the rotterhund, they just built up dirge points, and it just progresses throughout the fight. But for the Director's Cut, it builds more, it gets more dirge points off its turn, but the players have a way to interact with it. If they hit it really hard, it might knock the rotterhund off its dirge and it decreases the dirge points. And there's an element of...but it really relies on the Director telegraphing that to the players. Or even just flat out telling them this is how it works.
And then they get to feel like their decisions within the fight matter, you know. And I think that's really that's really important for TTRPGs and just battles in general, like the players should feel like their ideas and their tactics, whether they work or if they roll a little bit lower and it doesn't happen, they feel like their decisions matter. So that was that was a really fun thing to extrapolate on, was to create that side of it.
And that's really what I like, for my monsters to feel like the players have some kind of agency, like, what they do to the creatures matters. Like with the siren, they can kill its lure. They knock out a part of it, and the siren is bleeding. So there's a there's a tactical element to, you know, which one of them do you target first?
Jon de Nor: I really like that part of the siren design where the lure comes as a companion, almost, to the siren. But they need to stay adjacent to the siren at all times. And as you mentioned both, if you kill the lure first, you make the siren bleeding, but also, if you try to push the lure away, they also take damage because it's not like physically possible for them to separate like that.
Finn Brodie: Yes, yeah. That was really fun. It is quite a chunk of text, but I feel like it's one of those times where you read once and you've got the idea. It's pretty intuitive. But there is a really fun element of, everyone knows what siren is, so I was really excited to sort of bring this idea of like it's, you know, there's more to the siren lurking beneath the surface. And that was another really fun idea that I ran with.
But yeah, that design was really interesting and fun and...yeah, I didn't want to, I didn't want people to feel like, you know, if I force move the lure away from the siren, that nothing happens. Again, it should feel like they have agency and, you know, maybe it happens once and they see what happens and how they both take damage, and then the Null player just starts doing Knockback on the lure as much as possible.
Yeah. So it's just fun. I want my monsters to be fun. I want them to be interesting, and memorable, and...interesting. Fun.
Jon de Nor: I was really pleasantly surprised, when reading the second issue with the siren and the lure, that it wasn't all going to be solo monsters, because that was what I imagined initially, when you announced the magazine that, well, there's going to be one monster a month. Well, that's clearly going to be a solo. And it was for the first month. (laughter) But then for the second issue, you immediately went to an elite, and the lure as a horde, I think. So you created a very different encounter with those. And I really appreciated that it wasn't just, oops, all solos. (laughter)
Finn Brodie: Yeah! I mean, there is, I would like to see more solo monsters. And they are super fun. But I feel like if I only do solo monsters, it's very limiting. I'm limiting myself. But then it creates such a certain idea of, you know, it's a conversation I had to have with myself because, do I do also the monsters, or, you know, you think about...wyverns are a good example. You would think that wyverns might be like a solo monster, but there's two versions of it. If I don't want a creature to be a solo, do I then have to include two versions of it to make people feel like they're actually having enough content?
So it's something that I'm going to be...I'm going to take each monster on its own, and decide whether I think it's, you know, it needs to be a solo monster, or I can get two variations from it. So I think a lot of them will end up being solo monsters. But I do have ideas in the future about that weren't all there weren't always that.
Jon de Nor: I also wanted to mention, because before the monster statblocks, you do include, like, a bit of...well, both a backstory, or like some context for the monster itself, and you also include story hooks for the Director, like, why would the heroes end up fighting the sirens, for example? And you have some small hooks the Director can kind of get inspired by.
Finn Brodie: Yeah, I...it just it feels intuitive, like why would a monster magazine about a monster not include...? They don't have to be...I kind of toyed with the idea of how big or in-depth they need to be. And I tend towrad the solution that people enjoy writing their own stories. I don't think I need to give them any more than just like an idea that maybe they didn't have, a different way to think about it. Even if it just jolts a story out of their heads and they immediately start writing. I want to give people the tools to make their own fun. I don't want to do it for them or hold their hands, because people don't want that.
I think, from...the general consensus is that a majority of people don't play pre-made stories. I think that a lot of people probably did The Delian Tomb, but I think a lot of people just make their own stories. I did it. The Delian Tomb, I think, is the second pre-made story I've ever run in any TTRPG in ten years. Working through the book was a new experience for me.
So yeah, I don't want to take it off of them. I just want to give them the tools to do it themselves. And it's just a little, like a quick bullet point, a story idea they haven't thought of and it jolts, you know, it gets the creative juices flowing, that's a win for me.
Jon de Nor: And speaking of creative...juices, I guess...(laughter)...something that you include for both of the monsters is both a battlemap, but not just...because you mentioned in the text that Draw Steel, almost more than a lot of other TTRPGs, need good battlemaps. And you include both a battlemap, but also interesting features on those battlemaps, where not only like there is elevation, which I think is essential, but also like, other features of the terrain that you mention in the text for the map.
Finn Brodie: The creatures, it's their lair. It's their home. There should be elements of it that work for them, and then maybe some elements will work against them. So it's just more fun. I feel like a...it's like when you're in a video game and you're playing through an open world and you're exploring, and you're like, "Oh, I wonder if this area does this?"And you go over and it doesn't. Someone didn't cook quite hard enough here.
So I think it would be sad to create a map for a monster and not have it have these other features. Even me, when I'm making the maps, when I'm drawing them, it's fun for me to be like, "Oh, I could include some sharks in the water here." And then I can just create some small quick rule that's just...it's just fun. Yeah, so it's just more...again, it's...fun. And that's really what I'm aiming for with these creatures.
And also...I guess, the foundation of the Mythical Press is built on my disappointment for D&D's monsters. I think Fizban's Treasury of Dragons was the first one for me where I was super excited for the book, I bought the book, expecting to find all these monsters, all these dragons are super interesting. And they were just bland and boring and watered down. And I was like, not what I envisioned a book about dragons would be.
So I want to put in the effort. And basically, everything within my magazines is what I wish I had. If I saw that there was a magazine for Draw Steel and I was making monsters, what would I want to see in that? I feel like if I had a map, but with no annotations about it or any kind of useful tips or tools or ways to make it more interesting, that would be a loss. So it's important to me that the monsters and their lair feel like one coherent thing, rather than just the monsters and a random map. It should feel like this map was made for this monster.
Jon de Nor: That is so very often missing from, like, I feel, monsters in general, but with Draw Steel, as you mentioned, with good maps being so important, I think, for a better combat feel...I was really impressed with...
Finn Brodie: Well, thank you.
Jon de Nor: With both the maps and the art and just how much there is for each of the monsters. I mean, for the rotterhund, you even have like a companion for...
Finn Brodie: Yeah, that wsd my...(laughter)...the companion was a later addition to the rotterhund. But I was telling my friend about it — and my friend is, Lychen is his band, so he's making music for Mythical Press. But I was telling him about it, and what I'd created, and he was like, "Oh, that's really cool. Can you have one as like a pet?"
Jon de Nor: (laughter)
Finn Brodie: And I was like...the Beastheert has just come out. And I was like, "I've got to now, haven't I? I can't not now. I need...the rotterhund deserves to have a companion." So it was a later edition, but one that, as soon as he said that, I was like, yeah, it really needs one. And that's kind of where my ideas for the creatures come from. It's like, what does this creature deserve to make it feel mean and impactful and interesting? You know, like, a montage test to find the sirens — which I did not plan come out around The Odyssey.
Jon de Nor: (laughter) Oh, I didn't think of that! That's so good!
Finn Brodie: I'm not...I didn't plan it. If people thought I did, I'm very appreciative that they think I'm that clever. But yeah, it was just a happy coincidence. But, you know, it's that classic thing of being on the ship, and the sirens, and trying to find them through the mist, or hearing them through the mist. So that was, like, immediately, they deserve a montage test that does exactly that. And the rotterhund, like, similarly. And then the witch doesn't have a montage test, because there wasn't one that came to mind where I was like, the witch feels like she needs a montage test. But she definitely feels like she needed some rules for negotiation.
So each monster has...what comes with it is what I feel they deserve. And yeah, so that's basically my thought process when I created each one.
Jon de Nor: I really appreciate both having, like, a framework, but also being flexible about, tweaking or bending the framework when it needs to be bent to make it feel more...yeah.
Finn Brodie: Yeah, exactly. If my idea for each magazine is that it has to have a montage test, then I start thinking, "Okay, I'm doing this witch. I don't have an idea for a montage test. I need to come up with an idea." Rather than the idea just being there, and I'm like, "Well, I need to do this."
Jon de Nor: Yeah, yeah.
Finn Brodie: Because I feel like that will show in the design, and it will feel forced. And I want to respect players and not have to feel like I'm just I'm giving them something because I feel like they...it should...like, I did the montage test for the last one, this one needs one as well. But they were all...and sometimes I think a little bit more about the ideas, but as soon as I have an idea that I'm really happy with, and I get like hungry to make it, then I know I'm onto a winner, there. So yeah, I'm excited to play around with more, really.
Jon de Nor: And the last thing that I noted down that you make for each of the months, or at least so far, for the two we've seen, is a title for killing them, for like, here's the reward of taking one of them down.
Finn Brodie: Exactly, yeah. I mean, I want...my content is mainly for Directors, I guess, because I've always been the gamer and I've always been the GM, the DM, the Director. It's just in my blood to write and tell stories. And I love it. But I don't also want my content to only be for Directors. It's rather limiting. As a business, it's limiting for Mythical Press.
So yeah. But I'm happy to be the champion for Directors, who love monsters. The Mythical Press is a love letter to everyone who enjoys including my creatures in their stories, that are interesting, that...it's, Mythical Press is for you people, for those people.
But yeah, obviously, the players are...you know, you can't you can't...there are some games that do, like, you can just play a one-player TTRPG. But Draw Steel's not one of them. And so I also want to give them, you know, the players a reward for killing the creatures, and have that also be like a fun thing. What I like about titles as well is, you can kind of...it's almost like an item in a way. I've been playing around with that a little more. Like one of the options for the siren, for the title, was that they make a skin from its hide. And then the players get to have fun being like, imagining their, you know, imagining their players with a cape made from this, you know, sea serpent skin, that gives them some sort of benefits. And that's really fun as well. I feel like that's...players will enjoy that. And Directors will enjoy giving their players that. So yeah, it's fun.
Jon de Nor: I want to ask you one last question that I...or rather, I'm curious about what your ambitions are with the Mythical Press. Like how...is it a goal for you to make it like a part-time gig, or even more than that? Or is it like, is it your side project? (laughter)
Finn Brodie: The Mythical Press is, I hope I'll be doing it for years, and...my hope is that it can take over my part-time job, and I get to do it full-time. That is my hope. And the support so far in the past two months has been incredible. And it makes me feel like I'm on the right path for that. So I'm definitely gonna be providing more, but I definitely have plans for the Mythical Press to get bigger and better. I think it's going to keep to a monthly, like, nine releases a year. That will be that what it's largely going to be, but I do have ideas for other products to make, like books, and larger PDFs, where maybe there's like an archetype of creature that kind of deserves, rather than just have...again, it comes back to what this creature I feel like deserves. If there's a certain archetype of creature that maybe we haven't seen much in Draw Steel, I feel like there's a big opening there.
Yeah, if there's hunger there and people really want to see, like, more this kind of stuff, or I know that I want to see this kind of stuff in Draw Steel...if that archetype can't be put into one magazine, it was a thought I had of whether I have like issues where, for the next three months, it's just this archetype, and it's different versions.
Jon de Nor: Oh!
Finn Brodie: Yeah. And I might have ideas for some creatures that I think will fit that better. But then there are other types of creatures where I'm like, I feel like you want one big book with just everything you need, if you're like, I want this kind of creature in Draw Steel. And this one product from Mythical Press is the one-stop shop for...you don't need anything else. This is it.
So, I've got some very early ideas. And I'm beginning to make, like, the frameworks of how I'm putting them together. I think they'll probably be going to BackerKit rather than just Patreon, as larger products that I can work on. That basically transition...is my transitional period from the Mythical Press being a part-time love, to being...my full-time, you know, love.
Jon de Nor: (laughter)
Finn Brodie: (laughter) So, yeah, I don't want to give away too much. But if there's...I feel like if there's a certain kind of creature that anyone out there is like, I really want to see this creature in Draw Steel, then that's my kind of thought of, I don't want people to have to have, like, sift through multiple issues to like, piece together everything they need for this one creature, one kind of creature. I'd much rather create one book where they can be like, I need this one thing for all of that.
And I might include things in the future where it's just extrapolations off of that, and maybe I'll release them as bundles so they have them all in one place, but...I'm struggling whether I would give way too much or say anything. I'm scared that I'll utter the word of the creature on my mind, and then someone will steal my idea, and I won't be able to do it! (laughter) I'm gonna go for it, I'm gonna go for it. There's no particular timeline. I would love to be able to release it — not release it, but at least, release it on BackerKit next year. But I do have a whole idea for basically dinosaurs in Draw Steel.
Jon de Nor: Oh, yeah.
Finn Brodie: Which we, I think, in Look Out!, there are some, but I've got some ideas about how I can make that really, really fun. And, yeah, I'm excited. I'm excited for that to be my first big project, rather than the smaller projects. I can work on it throughout the year, if it succeeded, and then release it when it's ready. So yeah, I'm really excited for the next year. I'm really excited for 2027 for Mythical Press. I think it's gonna be...I think I'm going to have a lot of fun. I think people are gonna really enjoy what I release.
And also, on top of that, one of the things I wanted to talk about is also. in the month breaks we have, so after every three issues I'll have a month break. But I'm basically spending that month off with a poll, basically, for people to vote on for the next creatures that get to come out. As I said, the Mythical Press is, you know, my love letter to all the Directors and storytellers out there who want to include interesting creatures. I want them to have some type of agency over what they get to see. So I'll be, in December, I'll be holding a poll for March's release in 2027. I'm really excited for that, because I feel like that's going to be like a, almost like a community-chosen creature. And that's going to be really fun. I'm really excited for that.
Jon de Nor: We are closing in on the hour, and I always ask my guests to bring some kind of recommendation, or recommendations, to the listeners. So what have you brought?
Finn Brodie: I've been reading recently. I just rereading Robin Hobb's sagas. But it's books that I really enjoy. I read them when I was a teenager. And I can roughly remember what happened, but I'm now rereading them, and they are...I went from reading a couple of books that were a bit hard to chew through — so there were like a 300-page book, and I was taking far too long to read 300 pages — and then I've read 300 pages in about a week. I've chewed through her books, and they're amazing. So, Robin Hobb is a fantastic author, great storyteller. Yeah, so, if anyone's currently wanting a new book to read, jump on that, because they're fantastic.
Jon de Nor: An unknown recommendation for my part, but, I'll make sure to look into it because I'm looking for books to read. (laughter)
Finn Brodie: Yeah, and honestly, they're fantastic, they're good.
Jon de Nor: It has been a delight to have you on. I'm really excited about the upcoming issues of the Mythical Press, because the first two issues have really given me a taste for more.
Finn Brodie: Yeah, that's kind of what I wanted. I feel like they're both strong in their own right, but they're definitely, like, stepping stones to larger stuff. And, the witch I think, has been my most ambitious project yet. So I'm really excited for that. I don't want to overshadow the wode hag in Draw Steel, which is a really fun monster. It didn't really quite scratch the itch of the witch that...I'm a poet and I didn't know it.
Yeah, it didn't really scratch the itch of what I like to see from those kind of creatures. So my imagining of the witch is more in line with, like the Crones from The Witcher III, or Robert Eggers's The VVitch. Those kind of, more so, gritty, grounded, scary version of the witch, that's kind of what I've been in mind towards. So I don't want to — I feel like they can work in a vacuum, and work together almost, and feel like they can fit in their own category nicely without you having to choose which one you want to use.
Jon de Nor: I'm very much looking forward to it. (laughter)
Jon de Nor: Thank you so much for coming on, Finn. It's it's been great.
Finn Brodie: This has been incredible. Thank you so much.
Outro
Thank you so much for coming on Finn. I've really been enjoying the first two issues, and especially the siren. I think the design for the siren looks really interesting, and it invites the players to think tactically different.
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Next episode is on the 5th. That's the new episode for August, all that's new in one place.
See you next time. Snakkes.